Skip to main content

tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  July 31, 2018 5:00pm-6:00pm PDT

5:00 pm
let's hope donald trump can come out against something as menacing as a plastic pistol. a limit to his embrace of the far right gun crowd. let's hope if donald trump will, the federal courts will. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. >> tonight on all in. >> i am working with the whole team as well. >> time for paul manafort. day one of the trial of donald trump's former campaign chairman. >> and paul manafort has done an amazing job. >> why prosecutors are calling manafort a shrewd liar. and what we know about the manafort defense. then the star witness. >> one person, rick gates. >> rick gates. >> why all of trump world is worried about rick gates. plus, 98 days out, facebook says
5:01 pm
another round of election sabotage is underway. and the trump official who says his warnings about the psychological damage of separated families was ignored. >> good evening, from new york, i am chris hayes. paul manafort is a shrewd liar so says the prosecution in the opening statement in the trial. opening statement and even the testimony of first witness hours ago, paul manafort facing 18 counts. bank fraud, tax evaluation, and conspiracy charges. work with should note which predated his duties on the campaign of donald trump.
5:02 pm
manafort a man who attended the infamous trump towers meeting. that man paul manafort faced the first of two trials today. in his opening statement prosecutor part of mueller's team portrayed manafort as greedy, a shrewd liar and three bank accounts in three countries. the evidence shows he placed himself and his money above the law and every year he lied. filed false tax returns, committed bank fraud, lied about his property, his debts, his net worth, and established offshore accounts and shell companies to funnel his lavish lifestyle. trump's former deputy campaign
5:03 pm
chairman rick gates. much more on that in a moment. today's opening statement arrived far sooner than anyone expected. after the judge who proceeds over a court dubbed the rocket docket. taking a pool of 65 prospective jurors. the man at the center of it all, paul manafort arrived at the courthouse at 8:13 a.m. his bail was revoked because of charges that while out on bail, he tampered with a witness. his lawyer kevin downing telling a reporter this morning no chance his client will cooperate with the trial. i am joined by ken del lannian,
5:04 pm
and zoe fillman. >> i wrote down the word astonishing greed. we knew the outline of this tale from the indictment and court documents. but another thing to hear it lay out in court. this scheme whereby manafort was earning $16 million. but instead of taking the money in a wire transfer, he concocted this elaborate scheme to accept it in loans which weren't really loans all to evade taxes. and interestingly, when his client was scurried off to exiled and the spigot of cash turned off, then manafort turned to bank fraud because he was milking the real estate that he
5:05 pm
got with these gains because he needed the cash to fund his life style. so that paints a stark picture of the man who is the chairman of the trump campaign working for free in debt to russian oligarchs broke. a right target for russian recruitments. >> to that end, the judge, my understanding, the russia aspect of this won't really figure prominent prominently in this trial. >> that's right. the judge had made clear early on that he did not want this case, things that were not charged. nothing to do with the campaign, nothing to do with the allegations of the collusion between the trump campaign and russia during this election. discussion and request by the manafort team to ask the jury
5:06 pm
about whether they voted or any thoughts about the election and be the judge said no, we are not bringing that into the courtroom. so if you were a juror not paying attention to the case, you might not really know what is going on here. no mention of robert mueller, one or two offhand references to the special counsel office. no reference to the allegation, to the controversy of the witch hunt. and no reference to trump. his lawyer said was a political consultant who had worked for presidents. >> his defense team went out of his way to wrap manafort in the mantle of democrats. tad davine was the first
5:07 pm
witness. and i think that is no accident. we are in alexandria, virginia in a precinct that went for clinton. many of them are middle class people, and tend to be democrats. >> the road map laid out for the prosecution, we will get to the response, but the road map is that this is a case that they can show with a paper trail, right? >> right. what assistant u.s. attorney said they are going to show forms, his tax returns that show boxes were not checked that should have been, that should have indicated his foreign bank accounts and interest, these financial interests overseas that you are supposed to report. showing that you have foreign
5:08 pm
bank accounts worth more than $10,000. they are going to show that he was bringing in a lot more income than he was reporting. and show the jury documents that were falsified. documents that didn't accurately reflect the income that he had and what he was telling the u.s. government he was making and therefore could be taxed on. >> just to be clear on this, this is a set of charges that have to do with his financial dealings with as a consultant in ukraine and then bank fraud allegations in the u.s. so we talked about this sort of circumventing the american tax system. overseas payments and overseas bank accounts and never reported which is what is alleged. what is the bank fraud part of the case. >> it is the prosecutors allege that after 2014, when the spigot of cash was turned off, he
5:09 pm
needed to fund his lavish lifestyle. what he had was real estate holdings that he purchased through the bogus loans. what he did, was he began overstating the value of these property. faking a profit and loss statement for his company. showing cash that he didn't have for bankers including while he was chairman of the campaign. they call it bank c and that is the kind of fraud that they are alleging. prosecutors are going to show that in fact it was false. >> zoe, tad davine was there. he was a partner with manafort in his work in ukraine, what did
5:10 pm
he have to say? >> so tad talked about being brought in starting in 2005 to head media strategy for the pro russia ukraine political party, the party of regions that manafort worked for. davine talked about emails he exchanged with manafort detailing the extent of his work, the contract that he signed. and some of this evidence was evidence that manafort asked the judge to keep out of the trial, argued that getting too much into yanukovych might prejudice the jury. there is no agreement between the parties about how manafort made his money. how much money he made, where it came from. so this was relevant. and davine's testimony illustrated what appeared to be central tension. exactly how hands on manafort
5:11 pm
was in his business. whether he was the day-to-day, he knew everything that was going on. the questions from prosecutors tried to get at this idea of manafort as very hands-on. very involved in every aspect of his busy, trying to counter perhaps the defense narrative that manafort was high level and entrusted his financial dealings with his associates like rick gates and he thought even was going to do what they were supposed to with his finances and no intent to mislead any u.s. officials. >> thanks for that. appreciate it. learned a lot. >> possible legal repercussions let's bring in jill wine-banks, and legal analyst mimi roach. you got a case like this.
5:12 pm
and in some ways a boring case insofar as a lot of paper and money trails. so a little bit of spice. they talked about a $15,000 ostrich jacket. what is the approach here. >> it is a good point. you have to keep the jury's interest a little bit. sometimes dwelling on the str extravagant purchases. you know, really what the strategy here is going to be showing and it sounds like the prosecutor was cut off a little bit in the opening on this. but showing how much manafort loved his money. the ostrich jacket is not just quirky interesting fact, who buys that. and you could spend your money on a lot of things, there are a lot of objects to put that kind
5:13 pm
of money in, but an ostrich jacket is bought by somebody who is flamboyant and wants to sort of really relish and wear their money. >> someone who has been spending too much time around the oligarchs former soviet republic possibly. >> exactly. but it is going to make a defense that he wasn't involved in his business is very hard. >> so jill, we got to first look at the defense, and talk about rick gates who is a central witness here. the defense opening statement focused on rick gates who is paul manafort's deputy. and look, it was all this guy, the guy who is cooperating who is going to be testifying against our client, he is the guy in this. you can't trust him. >> it is often the approach of
5:14 pm
defendants where it is always someone else's fault. it seldom works especially in a case like this where the evidence will be visible to the jurors. they will see how much money came in, how much money was reported. and they will see the signatures on all of the bank accounts overseas. they will see who had the foreign bank accounts and who didn't. and i think this won't ultimately be successful. and it is exactly what donald trump is doing too. it is not me, it is someone else. always someone else's fault. >> this is an expensive defense. do we know how he is paying for it? >> we don't. the government is entitled to ask that. usually you get a vague
5:15 pm
response. i don't know, i haven't heard that they have done that in this case. maybe they, you know, hard to know why they wouldn't have done that here, i suppose in some ways they want him to be able to mount whatever defense he is going to mount because they have a strong case and if he is going to be convicted, they want everyone to know he has a fair trial. >> all of the people that i have been talking to, surprising it is going to trial. not going to plead, not going to cooperate. a lot of people feel like in similar situations, a case like this would have been pled out by now. >> i was surprised that it didn't plead much earlier, but at a certain point, he had spent so much money on the defense, that it makes no sense for him to start talking about cooperating at that point. but also very interesting if he is blaming his partner rick gates, rick gates pled out in
5:16 pm
part because he had no money. so now you have manafort saying he stole my money, embezzled money from me. how come rick gates doesn't have money to defend himself and you do. that would be my question. so that under cuts the argument that rick gates took the money. >> this courtroom which is sealed. at a time when it is the president's campaign manager. and the stuff that they are talking about he was doing, reporting to work by day to get donald trump elected and then filing false forms allegedly with banks? >> this artificial universe. presumably in jury selection the extremes are weeded out.
5:17 pm
many problems who don't follow this as closely as a lot of people do. >> god bless them. >> probably saner than we are right now. nonetheless, trials when this happens, jurors bring biases and things that they know to trials that happen every day. they hate cops, they never are going to believe a cop. all defendants that are charged must be guilty. those kind of people weeded out. i think that once you are in that courtroom, there is something about the judge, especially a judge like this who is keeping everyone so focused that they are able to get the jurors to focus on the law and the facts. >> and he seems to want to move this along quickly. thank you so much. >> next, the prosecutor's star witness, what rick gates knows
5:18 pm
that could have trump world worried in two minutes. today... back pain can't win. now introducing aleve back and muscle pain. only aleve targets tough pain for up to 12 hours with just one pill. aleve back & muscle. all day strong. all day long. [burke] abstract accident. seen ♪ video-it. covered it.c
5:19 pm
we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪
5:20 pm
today during opening statement, paul manafort's lawyer said manafort is in -- gates became partners with manafort consulting and lobbying for ukrainian politicians and oligarchs. when manafort 20 to trump campaign, gates went with him. rick gates stayed on the campaign and worked as liaison. he then stayed with trump after
5:21 pm
trump won as well working on the president's inaugural committee. and after that trump boosting america first policies. and after he was pushed out of the nonprofit, gates was hired by tom barrett. gates was rolled up alongside manafort. by february of this year, gates had a change of heart and he announced he was cooperating with mueller's team and now he centraled this team. he knows a lot. for more on how central rick gates is, joined by daniel goldman. how central is rick gates here?
5:22 pm
>> very central to this trial and central to anything involving paul manafort. what is more interesting than whether or not paul manafort evaded taxes or committed loan fraud which are serious crimes is what does rick gates know beyond paul manafort and his financial dealings from his life before the campaign? and as you just recited, he has been paul manafort's right hand man for decades. he knows a lot about what paul manafort knows and so that is going to become a bigger and bigger issue as the collusion investigation ramps up. >> that's the key to me. the thing i keep coming back to is that transition period where there was so much strange stuff going on. kislyak getting shuttled to
5:23 pm
trump tower. michael flynn lying to who he is talking to. he is there for that transition period too. that is a guy who presumably been talking to federal investigators and prosecutors for months now. >> it is timely that this is happening now and not at all surprising that rudy giuliani went on his circular tour of circular reasoning yesterday. right when paul manafort's lawyers would have received all of the notes and memos about everything rick gates has told mueller and his team. not just about the manafort trial but everything. >> is that the way it works? >> that's the way it works. they are obligated to turn over prior statements so they can be used for pros examination. >> the notes of that. turned over on the eve of trial
5:24 pm
for discovery. >> exactly. that is what they will use. you testified to x and you said y earlier. they will use that to try to trip him up. it is not a surprise that rudy giuliani is the first person to raise the notion of a pre meeting meeting. and one of the people he says in that meeting is rick gates. >> this idea that giuliani dropping these hints. here is what he had to say. >> lanny davis added there was a meeting two days before the meeting took place with donald jr., jared, manafort and two others. gates and one more person. >> and that's a real meeting. >> that's a real meeting on another provable subject in which he would not participate. >> your key supposition, we
5:25 pm
don't know, is that manafort's attorneys have in their hands everything that gates told federal prosecutor. how is that being communicated? >> through the lawyers. you are right, it is supposition, it is conjecture. and sometimes our limitations on whether they can share that information. >> what is the ethical guidelines. >> there is no ethical guidelines, it varies. and for all we know, mueller could have gone to the judge and said we want the keep the collusion stuff out of this material. i don't think that would win because you have to cross examine him. it goes to show how crucial rick gates would be to the collusion investigation. we are talking about michael cohen. he may have information. but a lot less for the reasons you described. and by the way, he wasn't there in the june 9th meeting.
5:26 pm
but if paul manafort left that meeting and went and told rick gates what happened, rick gates can testify to that as a comp y co-conspirator. manafort would have had better access to gates. but if he is telling gates, gates can relay that about what manafort is saying at the time. so you don't need manafort to cooperate if he is sharing. >> it is so fascinating when gates takes the stand. an amazing moment after all of this to see what he has to say. although a lot won't come up. >> that is what you to have recognize. not going to be talking about this stuff. >> daniel goldman, thanks for joining me. >> thank you. >> russians are using the exact same message of sustained criminal sabotage as they did in
5:27 pm
2016. and what the trump administration is or is not doing about it after this. it's so simple, i don't even have to think about it. so i think about mouthfeel. i don't think about the ink card. i think about nitrogen ice cream in supermarkets all over the world. i think about the details. fine, i obsess over the details. think about every part of your business except the one part that works without a thought your ink card. introducing chase ink business unlimited with unlimited 1.5% cash back on every purchase. chase for business. make more of what's yours. booking a flight doesn't have to be expensive. just go to priceline. it's the best place to book a flight a few days before my trip and still save up to 40%. just tap and go... for the best savings on flights, go to priceline.
5:28 pm
when heartburn hits... fight back fast with tums smoothies. it neutralizes stomach acid at the source. tum tum tum tum tums... smoothies... ...and introducing new tums sugar-free.
5:29 pm
california had the worst wildfire season on record. scientists say, our weather is becoming more extreme and we all have to be better prepared. that's why pg&e is adopting new and additional safety precautions to help us monitor and respond to dangerous weather. hi, i'm allison bagley, a meteorologist with pg&e's community wildfire safety program. we're working now, to enhance our weather forecasting capabilities, building a network of new weather stations to identify when and where extreme wildfire conditions may occur, so we can respond faster and better. we're installing cutting edge technology to provide real-time mapping and tracking of weather patterns. and we use this information in partnership with first responders and california's emergency response systems. to learn more about the community wildfire safety program and how you can help keep your home and community safe, visit pge.com/wildfiresafety
5:30 pm
dwrooir . already signs the playbook is underway. there were two main prongs of the strategy, the russia based internet research agency pretending to be americans to discord and try to sway voter opinion. also, a dozen russian officials trying to gain access to
5:31 pm
e-mails. now with just 98 days until the midterm election, here is where we are. senator claire mccaskill has already been targeted by hackers using these same kind of password stealing techniques that exposed john podesta in 2016. and today facebook announced it had uncovered a coordinated attempt to influence the midterm election many they say that quote some of the activity is consistent with what they saw from the russian based agency. anna scheckter has been covering this and joins me tonight. facebook made this announcement today, what did we learn? >> we learned that the exact same tactics have been used.
5:32 pm
it looks like the russians are behind it. although facebook can't say. they haven't found the russian ip addresses. there is a rally planned for august 12th and engaged real people to show up on august 12th. >> there is a group called black elevation, a group called confront and resist fascism. this is all the same kind of, what is uncanny about this is these are not actually the people they say they are. trying to foment conflict. >> that is right. but still getting people on board. and they had almost 300,000 followers. >> that is a big facebook page -- oh, across the pages. >> across the pages but 30 events taking place.
5:33 pm
who knows what is going to happen august 12th but calling them to show their fight. show as much discord and as much conflict. you saw in charlottesville, the result with a death and 19 people injured from that tense environment. now we don't know if the internet research agency had anything to do with it, but divisive issues. >> you also have a situation it seems to me where facebook and twitter killed off a bunch of accounts. this seems to be being policed by the companies. who is on the watch for this? >> the companies are working with an fbi task force working specifically on this issue. we didn't see the company's self-policing.
5:34 pm
but this complete cultural shift where we the users are saying, my data is all over the place. people want the companies to hold themselves to account. >> the key point to me is transparency. you don't want to be encountering stuff that is potentially produced by imposters. manipulating your psychology. >> it is deeply unsettling and to know that 30 of these events have already happened. i would like to know more about who showed up to those. and it's pretty sad. >> we will be learning more about how extensive all of this is. thank you so much. joining me now, is angus king of maine. senator, what do you think about the fact that it appears the exact same playbook is being
5:35 pm
operationalized this year as 2016? >> this is a big deal. as you pointed out, they are back at it. number two, buried in the story today, it appears they are doing it in a sophisticated way. disguising where this is coming from through vpns around the world. and what they are doing is taking aim at our system itself. the combination of the first amendment and democratically elected governments is exactly what they are focusing on. i call it geo political jew -- ju.
5:36 pm
>> what do you say if people say, i am not convinced that this is happening a huge effect. >> one of the things, and you mentioned we are going to have a hearing on this tomorrow before the senate intelligence meeting followed up. tomorrow are going to be experts on exactly what is going on. we think we are only seeing the tip of an iceberg. there is a lot more going on that is being used to manipulate us. and what they are doing is simply trying to sow discord and distrust they are doing a good job at it. >> has there been sufficient response from the trump administration? >> the short answer is no. just this morning secretary nielsen in new york started making the right kind of noises.
5:37 pm
the problem is the response has been spread across a lot of different departments. nobody was in charge. they set up a new office today, and that may help. the other thing she mentioned that is absolutely critical, we have got to convince the russians or the chinese, or the north koreans or whoever proposing to do something like this that they are going to pay a price. we are a cheap date, they knocked the hell out of our process in 2016, nothing that would change their calculus. we have to have a deterrent policy that they understand that if they do this, there is going to be hell to pay. and so far, that hasn't been forth coming. this administration, i have to
5:38 pm
say, the prior administration was adequate in developing a cyber deterrent strategy. >> let me ask you something, with index of their activity of 2016 campaign, you see, in the center of the chart, there is one line that is higher than any line. it is the single most active day for russian twitter trolls and bots. october 6, 2016. does that strike you as remarkable? >> i think it is a mere coincidence. of course it is remarkable. this wasn't some kind of random attack. this is very sophisticated. and one of the problems is that they are getting more sf sophisticated. we have to respond now and they know what they are doing and
5:39 pm
their weaponizing information and using it against us. this is dangerous for our democracy and we have to get our act together to be able to fend it off. >> senator angus king, thanks for making time. still to come, the trump administration was warned of the trauma they would inflict on children in their family separation policy. a warning that was ignored. plus tonight's thing one, thing two starts next. ty. until i held her. i found my tresiba® reason. now i'm doing more to lower my a1c. i take tresiba® once a day. tresiba® controls blood sugar for 24 hours for powerful a1c reduction. (woman) we'd been counting down to his retirement. it was our tresiba® reason. he needs insulin to control his high blood sugar and, at his age, he's at greater risk for low blood sugar. tresiba® releases
5:40 pm
slow and steady and works all day and night like the body's insulin. (vo) tresiba® is a long-acting insulin used to control high blood sugar in adults with diabetes. don't use tresiba® to treat diabetic ketoacidosis, during episodes of low blood sugar, or if you are allergic to any of its ingredients. don't share needles or insulin pens. don't reuse needles. the most common side effect is low blood sugar, which may cause dizziness, sweating, confusion, and headache. check your blood sugar. low blood sugar can be serious and may be life-threatening. injection site reactions may occur. tell your prescriber about all medicines you take and all your medical conditions. taking tzds with insulins like tresiba® may cause serious side effects like heart failure. your insulin dose shouldn't be changed without asking your prescriber. get medical help right away if you have trouble breathing, fast heartbeat, extreme drowsiness, swelling of your face, tongue or throat, dizziness or confusion. (man) i found my tresiba® reason. find yours. (vo) ask your health care provider about tresiba®. covered by most commercial health insurance and medicare part d plans.
5:41 pm
5:42 pm
but prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered... in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory. prevagen. healthier brain. better life.
5:43 pm
thing one tonight donald trump has been appointing judges at a record pace pushing through the senate more federal judges than any other recent president in his first two years stack in the courts with conservatives. and mitch mcconnell paving the way. even went so far to cancel most august recess. now, the mcconnell judge approval machine has ground to a halt. one member of the senate judiciary committee has gone missing. who would do a thing like that to mitch mcconnell in this guy
5:44 pm
and that is thing two in second sects. if you're on park street in reno, nevada, the high winds of the washoe zephyr could damage your siding. and that's very different than living on park ave in sheboygan, wisconsin, where ice dams could cause water damage. but no matter what park you live on, one of 10,000 local allstate agents knows yours. now that you know the truth, are you in good hands?
5:45 pm
so majority leader mitch mcconnell canceled the senate august recess. but one senator didn't listen. jeff flake posted this picture. marks a new day for this political country. flake is there observing the elections which is a first since mugabe left. now it certainly is possible this was a really important trip to senator flake. but he must have realized in his absence lasting approximately three more weeks is royally screwing over mcconnell and president trump who need flake in d.c. to continue their mission of packing the courts. maybe this is his way of riding
5:46 pm
off into the sunset. equity trades are just $4.95. so no matter what you trade, or where you trade, you'll only pay $4.95. fidelity. open an account today. you'll only pay $4.95. no matter how much you clean, does your house still smell stuffy? that's because your home is filled with soft surfaces that trap odors and release them back into the room. so, try febreze fabric refresher. febreze finds odors trapped in fabrics
5:47 pm
and cleans them away as it dries. use febreze every time you tidy up to keep your whole house smelling fresh air clean. fabric refresher even works for clothes you want to wear another day. make febreze part of your clean routine for whole home freshness. moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis was intense. my mom's pain from i wondered if she could do the stuff she does for us which is kinda, a lot. and if that pain could mean something worse. joint pain could mean joint damage. enbrel helps relieve joint pain, and helps stop further damage
5:48 pm
enbrel may lower your ability to fight infections. serious, sometimes fatal events including infections, tuberculosis, lymphoma other cancers, nervous system and blood disorders and allergic reactions have occurred. tell your doctor if you've been someplace where fungal infections are common. or if you're prone to infections, have cuts or sores, have had hepatitis b, have been treated for heart failure or if you have persistent fever, bruising, bleeding or paleness. don't start enbrel if you have an infection like the flu. since enbrel, my mom's back to being my mom. visit enbrel.com... and use the joint damage simulator to see how joint damage could progress. ask about enbrel. enbrel. fda approved for over 18 years. we really pride ourselves on making it easy for you >> tech: at safelite autoglass, to get your windshield fixed. with safelite, you can see exactly when we'll be there. saving you time for what you love most. >> kids: whoa! >> kids vo: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace ♪
5:49 pm
quote
5:50 pm
in june we brought you that story of a salvadorian mother. as most immigrant children taken from theirreunified by their parents, we're learning her experience and her son's experience is far from unique. many children are already showing the psychological scars of their ordeal. "the new york times" reporting on one child. a 5-year-old brazilian boy who asked for breast feeding when he was reunited with his mother. now his favorite game is patting down and shackling migrants with plastic cuffs. when visitors showed up in philadelphia, he krouxed behind the sofa. at least one detention center where children were held, children were given psycho tropic medication without consent. on monday in a case that included filings from kids about being forcibly injected with drugs and feeling side effects,
5:51 pm
a federal judge said the administration can no longer give them psycho tropic drugs without consent. not only it was damage done to these children foreseeable, it was foreseen within the administration. one health and human services official today telling the senate hearing that he warned the administration about what would happen. >> there's no question that separation of children from parents entails significant potential for traumatic psychological injury to the child. >> that's coming up, next. ♪ bright copper kettles and warm woolen mittens ♪ ♪ brown paper packages tied up with strings ♪ ♪ these are a few of my favorite things ♪ ♪ ♪
5:52 pm
♪now i'm gonna tell my momma♪ ♪that i'm a traveller ♪i'm gonna follow the sun♪ ♪now i'm gonna tell my momma ♪that i'm a traveller transitions™ light under control™ and the wolf huffed and puffed... like you do sometimes, grandpa? well, when you have copd, it can be hard to breathe. so my doctor said... symbicort can help you breathe better. starting within 5 minutes. it doesn't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden symptoms. doctor: symbicort helps provide significant improvement of your lung function. symbicort is for copd, including chronic bronchitis and emphysema. it should not be taken more than twice a day. it may increase your risk of lung infections, osteoporosis, and some eye problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. grandpa: symbicort could mean a day with better breathing. watch out, piggy! (giggles) get symbicort free at saveonsymbicort.com. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help.
5:53 pm
we have one to two fires a day and when you respond together and you put your lives on the line, you do have to surround yourself with experts. and for us the expert in gas and electric is pg&e. we run about 2,500/2,800 fire calls a year and on almost every one of those calls pg&e is responding to that call as well. and so when we show up to a fire and pg&e shows up with us it makes a tremendous team during a moment of crisis. i rely on them, the firefighters in this department rely on them,
5:54 pm
and so we have to practice safety everyday. utilizing pg&e's talent and expertise in that area trains our firefighters on the gas or electric aspect of a fire and when we have an emergency situation we are going to be much more skilled and prepared to mitigate that emergency for all concerned. the things we do every single day that puts ourselves in harm's way, and to have a partner that is so skilled at what they do is indispensable, and i couldn't ask for a better partner. any member of this panel saying to anyone, maybe this isn't such a good idea. commander? >> during the deliberative process over the previous year, we raised a number of concerns in the program about any policy which would result in family
5:55 pm
separation. due to concerns we had about the best interests of the child as well as about whether that would be operationally supportable and the bed capacity we have. >> that was an hhs official, asked by senator blumenthal, hey, did anyone there say don't rip the families apart? and i'll read this again. during the deliberative process, over the previous year, we raised concerns about any position which results in family separation due to the best interests of the child. in other words, absolutely we raise concerns. absolutely we warn them not to do it. absolutely it would be terrible for these children. do you know what the trump administration did? they went ahead and did it anyway. senator hirono, am i misreading that or is that how you heard it? >> that is how we heard it. the trump administration did not listen to the people and went ahead and instituted this very
5:56 pm
inhumane, cruel policy. >> what did you learn today? >> very clearly that when the homeland security people instituted it, and all these parents will be criminalally prosecuted, they have to separate the parents from the children and they had no plan or intention of ever unifying these children with their parents. what they can with these children was make them instant orphans and send them on health and human services jurisdiction and pretty much, homeland security washed their hands of it. but for this judge in san diego who said you will reunite these children. and the person who testified from health and human services said, when these children are now deemed unaccompanied children, they were not set up there to reunify them with their parents. they're are to find sponsors for them. they're to do other things.
5:57 pm
so chaos ensued. >> i want to stop you there. this is important and there's a lot of jargon. what you're saying and what that hhs official testified today, in your hearing, was that when they were taken from their parents, they were turned into what is called unaccompanied minors. the shelters that got them got them fast they had come alone. not with their parents. and those shelters have things in place to place them into foster care or adoption. >> yes. exactly. that's why the person from health and human services said, they were not set up to reunify these children with parents. the thing is, he said the thing that was wrong was the separation of these children from their parents because they became orphans. >> there's something about this story fills me about an old testament wrath. who is going to be held -- i
5:58 pm
feel like i want a difinitive accounting of who said what to whom, who raised red flags. is there any plan to get some after action report about what happened here? >> we can get to some specifics but basically, the president takes responsibility for this. it is his zero tolerance policy that resulted, and as articulated by the attorney general, all of a sudden we'll start prosecuting thousands of parents as criminals. so this didn't have to happen. as i said, but for this judge in san diego, who was by the way, appointed by a republican president. if this judge did not say to the administration, you will reunite these children, they still wouldn't be doing it. in fact, homeland security would have washed their hands and all these children would have been the responsibility of the health and human services.
5:59 pm
>> i guess what i'm trying to say is that's not good enough. your colleagues are chasing the deputy attorney general to the gates of hell to turn over documents torsion turn over underlying warrants that have never been turned over in the history of the modern fisa court and i feel like the congress needs to hold some accountability over what this administration has done is that the aftereffects it has caused to these children. >> i share your outrage. there is month way the house which is enabling the president to do all kinds of day on theic and cruel things, don't look to them of at least we had a hearing. three weeks ago, chairman grassley was only going to have the person from i.c.e. come testify. wait a minute. you have to have the health and
6:00 pm
human services people testify. there was never any intention to reunify these kids. and they said these family detention centers are like summer camps. so when i asked two of the five testifiers who had some experience, including the guy from i.c.e. experience with these family centers, would you send your kid to these so-called summer camps? i just got a lot of hemming and hawing. so we have an administration that still hasn't reunified some 700 kids. >> thank you for joining me. that's "all in" this evening. nicole wallace is in this evening. >> thank you. rachel has the night off. i am more distraught than you are. we have a ton of news to get to. for starters, they don't call at this time rocket docket for nothing. today paul manafort went on trial in a federal courtroom in xanld re, a vi